Rivian is opening its charging network to other EVs

Original Article ↗ Hacker News Discussion ↗

Rivian’s Network and This Change

  • Many were surprised Rivian even has its own fast‑charging network (~90–92 locations now, 3,500 planned).
  • Strategy so far: place DC fast chargers in remote, outdoorsy areas and national parks, complementing (not duplicating) urban chargers and Tesla Superchargers.
  • Opening the network is welcomed, especially by non‑Tesla drivers who want better access to “adventure” destinations.
  • Rollout to other EVs is phased; some are disappointed it isn’t “just a software update” due to hardware, voltage‑range, and payment-interface constraints.

Connector Standards and Compatibility

  • Strong pushback on the idea of “seven” meaningful plugs in North America; in practice the thread converges on:
    • DC: CCS1 and Tesla’s NACS/J3400 (with CHAdeMO described as effectively dead).
    • AC: J1772 (often integrated with CCS1).
  • Industry trend: migration to NACS/J3400; US has designated it the federal standard.
  • Adapters between CCS1 and NACS are widely available and relatively cheap; protocol-level compatibility helps.

Superchargers, Port Placement, and Cable Length

  • Rivians at Tesla Superchargers often occupy two stalls because Rivian’s port is front‑left vs Tesla’s rear‑left and cables are short.
  • Some blame Rivian design, others Tesla’s short-cable, Tesla‑only layout.
  • Newer V4 Superchargers and some other networks add longer, often liquid‑cooled cables and trailer‑friendly stalls, but longer cables have cost, efficiency, and theft downsides.

Economics and Reliability of Charging Networks

  • DC fast chargers are reported as expensive (tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars per plug with infrastructure), with additional ongoing grid “demand charges.”
  • Compared with gas stations, utilization is lower (many EVs charge at home), making standalone charging a tough business; subsidies (e.g., Dieselgate/EA, state and federal grants) are seen as key.
  • Tesla is portrayed as unusually cost‑efficient and possibly profitable; other networks are described as subsidy‑dependent.
  • Tesla and Rivian-branded networks are praised for uptime and rapid repairs; third‑party networks, especially Electrify America historically, are criticized for frequent outages and slow fixes, though some claim EA has improved markedly with newer hardware.
  • US subsidies now require high uptime (97%), which may push better maintenance.

User Experience and Payments

  • Many complain about fragmented apps, QR codes, and account setups; strong preference for “plug in and tap card/phone” or true plug‑and‑charge.
  • Some networks (ChargePoint, EVgo, 7‑Eleven, Tesla V4 in Europe) already offer contactless card/tap.
  • ISO 15118 “plug and charge” exists, and Tesla plus most automakers implement or plan to, but certificate management and roaming are still unsettled.
  • Europe is cited (by commenters) as ahead on standardizing contactless payment; US efforts via SAE and federal rules are emerging.

Standardization and Policy

  • Several argue lack of early North American standardization (vs. Europe/China) slowed private investment and created today’s connector and app chaos.
  • Others note that in practice, modern EV charging is already “two systems plus adapters,” and in-car navigation typically hides incompatible stations.

EV Adoption, Depreciation, and Used Market

  • Some see opening more networks (Tesla, Rivian) as crucial to easing range anxiety and mainstream adoption.
  • Noted that many buyers don’t fully understand charger compatibility and may wrongly assume any visible charger will work.
  • Depreciation of some EVs, especially early or high‑MSRP models, is called “crazy,” but others highlight that this makes used EVs and leases very attractive.
  • Commenters claim long battery life (often >80% capacity at 10 years/200k miles) and predict sharply lower pack replacement costs in coming years, though figures are speculative within the thread.

Ethical and Environmental Debates

  • One thread criticizes EVs for reliance on cobalt linked to child/slave labor in the DRC; another counters with the climate and health harms of continued fossil‑fuel use.
  • Acknowledgement that some chemistries are cobalt‑free, but the supply chain issues for cobalt remain a concern for some.

Miscellaneous Ideas and Side Topics

  • Suggestions: gas stations and restaurants as natural DC fast‑charge hubs; co‑locating chargers with retail/food to monetize the “captive audience.”
  • Discussion of land/real‑estate plays around stations vs. uncertainty about future much‑faster charging (sub‑10 or even sub‑20 minutes).
  • Peer‑to‑peer “emergency” charging at homes already exists via platforms like PlugShare.
  • Some argue third‑party chargers lack strong incentives for reliability, akin to low‑quality ATMs, while OEM‑linked networks have direct brand and sales exposure.