Delta Chat – Email Based PGP Encrypted Chat

Original Article ↗ Hacker News Discussion ↗

Project direction and P2P networking

  • Several commenters feel the landing page undersells the project; the blog post and FOSDEM talks give a much clearer picture of recent progress.
  • Strong interest in the new Iroh-based P2P layer: realtime channels, hole punching, and forward-secret end-to-end encryption for webxdc apps.
  • Some speculate about a future where SMTP is used only to bootstrap P2P connections and most chat traffic bypasses email entirely, retaining email mainly for interoperability.

Email backend: Gmail, providers, and Chatmail

  • People immediately ask how well it works with Gmail and Workspace; Delta Chat provides specific provider guidance, but some expect rate limiting on busy group chats.
  • There’s tension between “using Gmail defeats the point of decentralization” and “the point is that it works with what I already have and isn’t tied to any one company.”
  • One user reports repeated account lockouts from GMX due to ciphertext-heavy traffic; others point to Chatmail and public chatmail servers as an alternative.

Inbox handling and alias limitations

  • Delta Chat messages can appear in the normal inbox or a dedicated folder; this is configurable.
  • A detailed complaint describes broken behavior with email aliases: each message to an alias becomes a new group (main account + alias + sender), making it unusable as a general-purpose mail client.
  • Workarounds (multiple profiles) exist but are awkward; several agree that proper alias support is required if it’s to double as a normal email client.

Security, privacy, and PGP vs modern messengers

  • Email + IMAP is praised for censorship resistance and provider choice, especially in hostile environments.
  • Critiques focus on PGP’s historical lack of forward secrecy and email’s metadata exposure; later comments clarify that forward secrecy now exists for the new realtime P2P layer, not clearly for SMTP mail.
  • Extended debate compares Delta Chat’s model with Signal/WhatsApp:
    • Some argue double-ratchet messengers are ahead on privacy.
    • Others emphasize distrust of Meta, closed-source clients, non-reproducible builds, and app-store–delivered targeted backdoors.
    • Counterarguments note that reverse engineering is possible and that a silent client backdoor would be a major PR risk, though others doubt consequences would be severe.

Email vs “true” IM protocols

  • One camp argues that email-based IM is “good enough,” leverages existing infrastructure, and avoids new account silos; several long-term users report it’s “blazing fast” in practice.
  • Another camp insists email is fundamentally the wrong protocol for instant messaging and prefers XMPP or Matrix; they cite email’s delivery assumptions and UX differences.
  • Broader discussion covers why WhatsApp (phone-number identity, low friction, chat UX) beat email-based approaches.

Apps and real-world usage

  • webxdc apps are highlighted, including a simple chess app that fits “no-registration, easy-for-elders” use cases.
  • Sentiment is mixed overall: enthusiasts say Delta Chat “really works” and outperforms Matrix/XMPP for them; skeptics question combining PGP and email, provider reliability, and UX edge cases.