Kagi Is Bringing Orion Web Browser to Linux

Original Article ↗ Hacker News Discussion ↗

Search Results, Discovery, and “Small Web”

  • Some users complain Kagi caps results (~100 items), making old-style “serendipitous” surfing via deep pagination impossible.
  • Others argue fewer, higher‑quality results are the point; if you want volume you can always fall back to Google via a bang.
  • Several mention Kagi’s “lenses” (small web, forums, academic) and “Small Web” feature as partial answers for discovery.
  • A minority want search engines to act as neutral indexes returning all matching URLs, not curated answers.

Privacy, Payments, and Anonymity

  • Kagi requiring a physical address for paid accounts is seen as a privacy and anonymity downside, even with crypto payments; tax/VAT rules are suggested as the reason.
  • Privacy Pass is discussed as a way to decouple identity from search usage, but some note it requires installing a Kagi extension, reintroducing a trust surface.
  • Debate over whether “monitoring traffic” is enough to verify privacy in closed software; one side says yes, another notes software can evade monitoring and argues for open source plus reproducible builds.

Orion Browser Experience (iOS/macOS)

  • Many praise Orion on iOS for strong ad blocking (including YouTube), extension support, and Kagi integration; others report that uBlock Origin on iOS either doesn’t truly work or is confusingly presented.
  • On macOS, experiences are mixed: some daily‑drive it without issues, others report serious bugs (battery drain, crashes, extension incompatibility, text selection glitches, YouTube failures).
  • Some feel Orion duplicates Safari with extra bugs and missing system integrations (Apple Pay, keychain, SMS code autofill), making it hard to stick with.

Closed Source, Engines, and Platform Choice

  • A recurring objection: Orion is proprietary; several say a closed‑source browser is a dealbreaker regardless of WebKit diversity.
  • Others welcome another non‑Chromium engine with decent UX, positioning Orion as a “Safari Pro”/“GNOME Web Pro”‑style browser with power‑user features.
  • There’s debate on why Linux is targeted before Windows/Android: suggested reasons include WebKitGTK maturity, alignment with Kagi’s user base, and easier porting.

Search Quality, Indexing, and Business Model

  • Many report Kagi search being substantially better than Google/DDG, especially due to customization (block/derank domains, lenses) and integrated LLM summaries.
  • Others accuse Kagi of “reselling Bing” and not building a “real” independent index.
  • Some worry Kagi is overextending (browser, translate, possible email) instead of focusing on search; Kagi’s position is that multiple products create a user‑centric ecosystem and reduce dependency on big platforms.
  • Paid subscription as a clear business model is viewed positively vs ad‑driven or crypto‑driven approaches.

Default Search, Browser–Search Collusion

  • Using Kagi on desktop Firefox/Chromium is mostly described as trivial.
  • iOS/Safari is cited as the main pain point: users resort to apps/extensions that intercept search URLs, with flaky behavior. This is framed as evidence of deep entanglement between major browsers and default search deals.
  • There’s an extended back‑and‑forth over whether this constitutes “collusion,” and whether it’s mainly an Apple issue vs a broader industry one.

Regional/Jurisdiction Concerns and Alternatives

  • Some European users aim to avoid US‑based services for political, legal, or stability reasons, asking for EU‑hosted alternatives; others say quality still favors Kagi.
  • Various alternatives are mentioned: Marginalia, Stract, Million Short, GOOD search, Mullvad’s Leta, European initiatives (Qwant/Ecosia index, OpenWebSearch.eu), but consensus is that nothing fully matches Kagi’s quality yet.

Trials, Billing, and Communication

  • A Kagi promo email offering a “no strings attached” trial annoyed some because the Stripe screen suggests auto‑billing afterward.
  • Clarifications: Kagi says trials without a payment method auto‑cancel; Stripe’s UI text is inflexible and misleading, which Kagi acknowledges as a communication problem.