'The old order is not coming back,' Carney says in speech at Davos

Middle powers, alliances, and “strategic autonomy”

• Many see the “rules-based order” as always having been asymmetric: great powers ignore rules; middle powers comply until trouble hits them anyway.
• Proposed response: middle powers (esp. Europe, Canada) should band together economically and militarily, possibly shifting procurement and supply chains away from the U.S.
• Debate over whether “strategic autonomy” is compatible with alliances: some argue autonomy and alliances coexist (historical NATO examples), others say the point of an alliance is precisely to give up some autonomy for collective deterrence.

U.S. reliability, Trump, and the end of hegemony-as-legitimacy

• Carney’s blunt framing of the U.S. as weaponizing economic integration is seen as something leaders wouldn’t have dared say publicly a decade ago.
• Many non‑U.S. commenters argue that electing Trump twice proves the U.S. is an unreliable partner and that others must decouple or hedge.
• Others note U.S. voters were mainly sending messages internally (border, identity politics, economic frustration), not thinking about global implications, but concede that externally the signal of “hijackable system” is devastating.
• Sharp disagreement over Trump’s role in Jan 6 and fake electors: from “hyperbolic to call it a coup” to “clear insurrection against constitutional order.”

Economic coercion and sanctions as weapons

• Carney’s line about economic integration as coercion resonates strongly; several detail how sanctions on countries and individuals function like weapons.
• A cited study is used to argue unilateral sanctions can cause mortality on a scale comparable to armed conflict.
• Others respond that, despite this, full-scale war is still worse; sanctions are seen as an intermediate tool in a grim hierarchy.

Canadian context and skepticism about Carney

• Some Canadians praise Carney’s clarity and see him as a bulwark against U.S. predation; others are deeply cynical, viewing him as a banker fronting for an elite-dominated system.
• Complaints focus on housing, productivity, corruption scandals, hollowed-out middle class, and tech brain drain to the U.S.; they argue speeches don’t fix structural rot.
• Side debate over Canada’s relationship to the monarchy and over its handling of Sikh separatists illustrates how “rules-based order” rhetoric can look hypocritical from abroad.

Historical analogies and darker trajectories

• Multiple threads compare the moment to Rome’s decline, WW2 alignments, or a return to open imperialism.
• Concern that a fully imperial U.S. would require something like WWIII to contain; others fear AI‑enhanced surveillance will lock in authoritarian trends globally.
• Several note a feeling of “living through capital‑H History,” and wish instead for “uninteresting times.”