In 6 violent encounters, evidence contradicts immigration officials' narratives

Federal vs. State Roles and Crowd Control

• Many argue federal immigration forces lack training in nonviolent crowd control and are effectively “militarized citizens” placed in stressful situations with minimal preparation.
• Some suggest involving local or state police, who are seen as more experienced and somewhat less prone to violence.
• Others counter that state and local police are not obligated to enforce federal law; non-cooperation by “sanctuary” jurisdictions is framed as a constitutional feature, not a bug.
• Examples cited: Minnesota police handing over criminal non-citizens but refusing warrantless raids and “fishing expeditions,” and a state declining to deploy police to assist controversial ICE actions.

Why Crowds and Confrontations Are Different Now

• Commenters note that ICE and predecessors long conducted raids without sparking similar public confrontations.
• Explanations offered:
  • Rapid expansion, big funding increases, low training, vague missions, and perceived arrest quotas.
  • Guidance that allegedly conflicts with constitutional limits (e.g., entering homes without judicial warrants, racial profiling).
  • More extreme tactics: masks, unmarked vans, and operations against people clearly on track to legal status (e.g., halting a naturalization ceremony).
• Some characterize ICE as having been turned into “death squads” targeting dissidents, not just undocumented immigrants.

Intentional Cruelty, Fascism, and Historical Continuity

• Several see deliberate cruelty as the political goal, not a side effect, and argue that a core voter base explicitly rewards it.
• There is debate over whether this is new:
  • One side says paramilitary occupation of cities, instant “domestic terrorist” labeling, and public executions on video are unprecedented escalations.
  • Another argues similar dehumanization long targeted people of color; the tactics now feel new mainly because they’re more visible and directed at more groups.
• Fascism is described as having existed in the U.S. for a long time, now openly encouraged.

Propaganda, Narrative Control, and Bad Faith

• The thread focuses heavily on officials’ rapid, fact-free defense of agents and immediate smearing of dead citizens, contrasted with video evidence.
• Commenters describe a strategy of:
  • Controlling the narrative from the outset, unconcerned with later contradictions.
  • Repeating obvious lies until supporters choose them over their own eyes.
  • Using inconsistent, absurd arguments in bad faith to exhaust opponents rather than persuade.
• This is seen as radicalizing some by exposing government lies, while also creating a bloc of supporters seemingly willing to accept any abuse, including in opaque detention facilities where evidence is scarce.