De-googling, so far

Original Article ↗ Hacker News Discussion ↗

Efforts to “de-google” personal tech stacks center on replacing Gmail, Android, Maps, Search, and especially YouTube with privacy‑respecting or self‑hosted alternatives, with mixed success. Commenters highlight workable swaps like Fastmail, Proton, Kagi, GrapheneOS, and PeerTube, but note that shared Google Docs, Google Voice, and YouTube’s unmatched content and infrastructure remain major lock‑in points. Underlying this is a broader debate: whether the main goal is true privacy and data ownership, simply reducing dependence on a single ad-driven giant, or accepting some tracking in exchange for convenience and quality.

YouTube and video platforms

  • Many see YouTube as the only truly irreplaceable Google product because of its unmatched content library and network effects.
  • People mitigate Google’s control with tools: NewPipe, FreeTube, SmartTube, yt‑dl/yt‑dlp, ReVanced, SponsorBlock, uBlock, custom frontends, and local downloads.
  • Nebula, Odysee, PeerTube, Netflix-as-YouTube-host, and self‑hosting are discussed as partial alternatives. They’re liked for better incentives and fewer ads, but lack breadth of content and/or polish (e.g., Nebula TV app issues).
  • Debate over ethics: some argue adblocking/sponsor-skipping is justified given surveillance and aggressive ads; others say it “leeches” from creators and prefer paying Premium.

Search engines and Kagi debate

  • DuckDuckGo is criticized for IP-based localization, irrelevant localized results, and strange/noisy results; some still use it with URL parameters.
  • Kagi is praised as the only truly superior de‑Googling option for search, with better filtering and incentives aligned via subscription.
  • Skeptics say it’s hard to justify another paid subscription and question the privacy benefit of an identity‑tied login.
  • Brave Search and searx are mentioned as non‑Google/Bing options; DDG is noted as essentially a Bing frontend.

Email, domains, and account lock‑in

  • Many move from Gmail to providers like Fastmail, Proton, Migadu, Tutanota, Dreamhost, pair.com, and self‑hosted stacks (e.g., Zimbra, mailinabox).
  • Owning your own domain is seen as critical to avoid lock‑in; Google Domains’ sale to Squarespace is noted.
  • Goal for some is not zero‑Google but ensuring that losing a Google account isn’t catastrophic.
  • Concerns raised about any provider’s failure; answer is domain ownership plus backups and easy MX switching.
  • Proton Mail’s privacy is debated; “NSA honeypot” rumors are raised, and Proton’s own responses emphasize client‑side encryption and open-source crypto.

Maps and location services

  • Organic Maps / OSM are praised for navigation and walking, but Google Maps remains superior for business search, opening hours, transit planning, and Street View.
  • Apple Maps and Bing’s street‑view‑like features are mentioned; some accept Apple as “less ad‑driven” but still closed.

Android de-Googling and apps

  • Users report success with GrapheneOS/LineageOS, F-Droid, Fossify, NewPipe/FreeTube, Organic Maps, Aegis, Syncthing, etc.
  • Pain points: Android Auto, Google Pay, VoLTE support, bank tap‑to‑pay, and poor search in OSM apps for some regions.
  • GrapheneOS devs note Android Auto works via sandboxed Play; Google Pay is technically possible but blocked by attestation policy.

Privacy, data collection, and risk views

  • One camp sees Google as uniquely dangerous: pervasive tracking, real‑time ad auctions, government access, and “stalking” via phones. Examples cited include law‑enforcement geofence warrants and health‑site tracking.
  • Another camp argues Google may be safer than small vendors due to stronger internal controls and public scrutiny; worries focus more on random SMEs leaking/selling data.
  • Some argue privacy is already largely lost; they focus instead on data ownership, local copies, and being able to move providers.

Attitudes toward de-Googling effort and scope

  • Some consider full de‑Googling “a lot of work for little benefit” and keep using best‑in‑class Google services with adblockers or paid tiers.
  • Others prioritize “not feeding the beast,” even at cost of convenience, and applaud those who push back on the ad / tracking ecosystem.
  • A recurring theme: partial de‑Googling (email, storage, search) while accepting that YouTube and Maps may remain, at least for now.

Self-hosting and intermediaries

  • Several participants self‑host email, contacts (Radicale/DAViS), files (Nextcloud, Seafile, WebDAV), notes, RSS (Tiny Tiny RSS), and media (Immich, Jellyfin, paperless‑ngx).
  • One viewpoint criticizes the reflex to replace every Google intermediary with another intermediary; suggests sometimes the right move is to avoid intermediaries or server‑side workflows entirely where possible.