Ancient Sumerians created the first writing system
Ancient Sumerian cuneiform is examined as the earliest known writing system, prompting debate over what it really means to call something “first” when future discoveries may predate it. Commenters explore how writing likely evolved from accounting and symbolic marks in complex agricultural societies, contrasting this with older oral traditions and non-durable record-keeping like knots or bark markings. The conversation widens into questions of how historians define “history” versus “prehistory,” how much our picture is biased by what survives in clay and stone, and whether claims about the “first civilization” or “first writing” should always be framed as provisional.
Epistemology and “First Writing System”
- Many argue claims like “first writing system” should explicitly say “that we know of as of 2024,” since future finds can overturn them.
- Others find that redundant in everyday language; outside philosophy, “know” is usually taken pragmatically.
- Several comments stress that all historical and scientific claims are provisional and based on incomplete evidence; you can’t prove no earlier system ever existed.
- Some suggest explicitly marking differing certainty levels (e.g., Neil Armstrong as “first” vs. Everest “first confirmed”).
Archaeological Record & Survivorship Bias
- Discussion of how clay tablets bias what survives: cuneiform may be prominent because fired clay endures, unlike wood, bark, rope, or leaves.
- People note other recording systems (e.g., knots, stick charts) and that many media rot, so absence of evidence isn’t strong evidence of absence.
- Counterpoint: for Sumerian cuneiform we can trace a clear local evolution from accounting tokens to full script, suggesting it wasn’t copied from an earlier, lost script.
What Counts as “History” and “Writing”
- One strand critiques the article’s “without writing, there was no history,” pointing to long-lived oral traditions (e.g., Aboriginal stories, griot lineages).
- Others respond that in academic usage “history” is often defined as events attested in written/durable records; everything earlier is “prehistory,” without devaluing oral sources.
- Debate over definitions of “writing”: simple marks (“danger” signs, tally marks, symbols in cave art) vs. full systems that encode language with grammar and sentences.
Cities, Civilization, and Environment
- Disagreement over when true “cities” first appear and whether walls and food-import dependence are required.
- Some emphasize that large, earlier Neolithic settlements and monumental structures (Göbekli Tepe, Jericho tower, tells) show sophisticated organization before Sumer.
- Environmental contrast: Nile floods were predictable and benign; Tigris–Euphrates floods were erratic and dangerous, possibly shaping different religious and social outlooks.
Alternative Civilizations and Priority Claims
- Mentions of Cucuteni–Trypillia, Vinca, Indus, Egypt, early Chinese cultures, and recent Syrian alphabet find; consensus in-thread is that Sumer still holds the earliest well-attested writing system, while other “first civilization” claims (e.g., for China) are seen as myth-based.
Education, Politics, and Public Understanding
- Some wish for periodic “update” education on topics like dinosaurs and ancient history; others point to community colleges, YouTube, and podcasts as de facto solutions.
- Tangents on U.S. education funding, partisanship, and rhetorical tactics (e.g., “sealioning”) highlight how politics shapes how history and science are communicated.