The lost joy of music piracy

Original Article ↗ Hacker News Discussion ↗

Nostalgia for the early 2000s “golden age” of music piracy runs through this exchange, with many recalling private trackers like OiNK and What.cd as uniquely rich archives and discovery communities that streaming services have never fully replaced. Participants contrast the control and permanence of local FLAC/MP3 collections with the convenience but instability and narrow catalogs of Spotify, Apple Music, and YouTube, especially for obscure, out‑of‑print, or non‑Western releases. Ethical fault lines remain: some see piracy as harmful theft, others as preservation and necessary access in a system skewed toward labels and platforms, a tension now sharpened by AI models trained on vast, often pirated music corpora.

Surviving ecosystems of music piracy

  • Many say music piracy is “alive and well” but more niche: private trackers (e.g., RED, Orpheus), Soulseek (incl. slskd, Nicotine++), Rutracker, anime‑focused trackers, i2p trackers, IRC, blogspots.
  • Public P2P in the West seen as weakened by ISP/DMCA pressure; private or RU/UA communities and Soulseek remain strong.
  • Some automate or script seeding/transcoding, run seedboxes, or self‑host servers (Navidrome, LMS, Plex/Plexamp).

What.cd / OiNK nostalgia

  • OiNK and What.cd remembered as “magical”: deep catalogs, meticulous metadata, curated collections, and exceptional forums.
  • Their shutdown is compared to burning a cultural library; some data (metadata, assets) survives in archive.org releases and successor trackers.
  • People especially miss the forums’ thoughtful, longform discussion and high signal‑to‑noise.

Streaming vs piracy and ownership

  • Streaming praised for convenience, discovery playlists, social playlists, and huge catalogs—good enough for “most people.”
  • Criticisms: missing/removed albums, regional blocks, unstable catalogs breaking playlists, low artist royalties, DRM, and lack of real ownership.
  • Several users keep large local FLAC/MP3 libraries (often partly pirated), sync via self‑hosted apps, or still buy CDs/vinyl/Bandcamp downloads.
  • Some left streaming after removals; others combine streaming for discovery with buying “the really good stuff.”

Ethics and legality

  • Strong disagreement: some frame piracy as “stealing” and harmful to musicians; others insist it’s copyright infringement, not theft, and often a discovery tool that eventually drives purchases.
  • Debate over whether inability to pay justifies piracy; one side says “never,” others say it’s morally fine for broke fans and often tolerated by indie artists.
  • Discussion of harsh enforcement (e.g., lawsuits, police raids) and how law protects corporate interests more than culture.

Discovery, community, and curation

  • Many miss pre‑algorithm discovery: LAN parties, mix CDs/tapes, BBSes, DC++, campus tools, Audiogalaxy, Soulseek browsing, blogspots, Last.fm, MySpace, WeAreHunted.
  • Some recreate this with workplace “music leagues,” shared playlists, asking friends to build playlists, college/indie radio, SomaFM, radio.garden, Bandcamp, Soundcloud, and label‑focused digging.
  • Several argue algorithmic recommendations overfit, reinforce sameness, and crowd out reflection; others say Spotify/YouTube Music Discover Weekly, “fans also like,” and album radios work well if actively curated.

Audio quality and formats

  • Debate over audibility of differences between lossless vs 128 kbps MP3/Ogg/Opus; experiences vary with age, hearing, gear, and encoding quality.
  • Concern about “mystery meat” sources and multi‑generation lossy transcoding from YouTube/Bandcamp.
  • Vinyl vs digital sparks a side debate: some emphasize vinyl’s technical and mastering characteristics; others say the appeal is mostly nostalgia and physical artistry.

Preservation, availability, and archives

  • Streaming catalogs do not cover all music; many niche, older, non‑Western, and live‑mix releases exist only via piracy, old rips, or collectors.
  • Private trackers and Rutracker are seen as crucial cultural preservation systems, storing rare CDs, out‑of‑print material, and specific masterings.
  • Some argue it’s acceptable—or even better—for artists that their work is preserved and heard via piracy than to vanish due to rights or label neglect.

AI and piracy

  • Several speculate that historic pirate archives have already been ingested into AI music models, “fed to the machine.”
  • Some view AI‑driven scraping as hypocritical: individuals were punished for piracy, while large companies exploit massive unlicensed corpora with few consequences.