macOS 15.0 supports Nested Virtualization on M3 chips

Original Article ↗ Hacker News Discussion ↗

Apple’s Platform Strategy and iPadOS Limitations

  • Many argue iPadOS’s lack of virtualization (and ability to run macOS or other OSes) is about control and market segmentation, not just technical constraints.
  • Some compare this to Windows editions (Home vs Pro with Hyper-V), while others say it’s fundamentally different because Windows still allows arbitrary code and third‑party hypervisors, whereas iPadOS blocks non-trivial system-level code entirely.
  • Debate over intent: one side says controlling all code and app distribution (and the 30% cut) is the primary design choice; the other says segmentation between devices/OS tiers is the core driver, with code control as a side effect.
  • There is frustration that powerful, expensive iPads can’t run alternative OSes or VMs, limiting their usefulness compared to Android/Windows tablets and 2‑in‑1s.

e‑Waste, Bootloader Locking, and Alternative OSes

  • Some call iPads “e‑waste champions” once updates stop, arguing old hardware could run Linux or other OSes as browsers, kiosks, photo frames, IoT panels, etc., if bootloaders were unlockable after support ends.
  • Others counter that iPads already have long lifespans (7–9 years of updates, continued usability after) and are far better supported than most PCs/tablets.
  • Disagreement on whether running Linux on old iPads would be widely useful vs. a niche, high-effort project with limited real-world gain.
  • There is a rights/ownership clash: some want a legal right to unlock and repurpose devices; others explicitly prefer “closed” devices (like cars) and see opening as weakening security.

Linux on Desktop/Tablet Viability

  • One camp says open source cannot yet produce enough polished software for mainstream desktop/tablet use, citing rough edges like drivers and crashes.
  • Another camp insists Linux has been “desktop‑ready” for years, with multiple touch/tablet UIs (Plasma Mobile, Ubuntu Touch, GNOME/Phosh), and that issues are comparable to those on proprietary OSes.

Nested Virtualization Use Cases on macOS 15 / M3

  • Practical uses mentioned:
    • Running Windows ARM with Hyper‑V features (e.g., WSL2, credential guard) inside a VM.
    • CI systems that run VMs inside VMs for isolation and test environments.
    • Docker Desktop or other Linux‑VM‑based tools inside macOS VMs.
  • Clarifications:
    • Nested virtualization is VMs inside VMs.
    • It does not help iPadOS, which lacks any virtualization framework.
    • Older Intel macOS versions (e.g., Mojave for 32‑bit apps) require emulation on Apple Silicon and are very slow.
    • Asahi Linux already exposes nested virtualization on some Apple Silicon where macOS does not.

Other Technical/Segmentation Points

  • Some complain about other Apple feature segmentation (e.g., always‑on display limited to specific iPhone models via hardware like LTPO/ProMotion).
  • There is disappointment about missing features like robust USB passthrough in Apple’s Virtualization.framework, though third‑party tools may partially address this.
  • A few note Intel CPUs have had nested virtualization for a long time, implying Apple is late to expose it.